Re: OT: The so called "steep learning curve" of vim...

vim & emacs: Well - the whole discussion is pointless because we're not
talking about "what should be learned".

Even notepad can do things Vim can't: Open registry dump files!

So use the right tool for a job. And if you want to learn about Vim -
and you're helpless - then ask somebody knowing how to find the tool, or
use the website. Its not a Vim problem. Yes - at the beginning I didn't
knew how to quit Vim - yet I learned it. I even was too dump to
understand the press :q because ":" is often used as separator - and I
only experienced the Windows world before.

You all say productivity of Vim is great - well - yes after writing tons
of plugins (depending on what you do) - and even then you feel limited.
Or why do people start writing eclim like bridges (talking about
programming).

Now is Eclipse more productive than Vim?
Eclipse can highlight used and unused #ifdef regions, Vim cannot
(AFAIK).
Thus given infinite amount of time - which tool will be more productive
if your task is to understand fast which lines are actually used?

So don't forget that there are also other tools - and use what it fits
your needs.

And if you're worried that new users fail to get started with Vim - then
teach them how to use google instead of telling them where to find help.

Linux users will soon learn that there is "man", Windows users are used
to F1 and a Help menu - and everything exists and works.

However

:helpgrep mailinglist does not show anything - WHY?
:helpgrep irc shows nothing (but my own documentation of my plugins! [1])
:helpgrep chat (same)
:h community (does not exist)
:helpgrep community (one hit: on the netbeans page)

But its us helping new users and giving them those hints

Should we fix that?

So what about adding a help file about the community containing pointers
to the internet relay chat, and the mailinglist?

If "productivity" was the thing you want to measure - and if you're a
writer - and think "Vim is the tool I always tried to learn" - then also
have a look at plover: http://plover.stenoknight.com/
It may allow you to write with 200WPMs and more after some training.
Maybe that's providing a bigger "productivity boost" - than all Vim
knowledge.

So how do you feel about the community? Should we be mentioned in the
help files?

How much of you (readers of this mailinglist) would have benefited
knowing about this mailinglist or the #vim irc chat room earlier?

Marc Weber

[1]
vim-addon-haskell.txt|40 col 3| irc.freenode.net: MarcWeber
vim-addon-manager-additional-documentation.txt|1147 col 21| Of course #git on irc.freenode.net is willing to help if you have trouble
vim-addon-manager-getting-started.txt|38 col 6| Join irc.freenode.net, /join #vim. Ask there. VAM has many users
tovl.txt|145 col 16| MarcWeber on irc.freenode.org or mail: marco-oweber@gmx.de
lang_haskell.txt|133 col 16| MarcWeber on irc.freenode.org or mail: marco-oweber@gmx.de

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